SaaS Stories
SaaS Stories is my not-so-secret quest to learn what it truly takes to succeed in the world of SaaS—and I’m inviting you along for the ride! I have the pleasure of sitting down with brilliant minds and industry trailblazers to explore their journeys, uncovering the secrets behind their growth, the gaps they spotted in the market, and what really drives them.
It’s not all smooth sailing—there are challenges, unexpected turns, and moments of reflection where they share what they’d love to change about their journey. Think of it as a candid, insider’s look into the world of SaaS, with just the right amount of curiosity, empathy, and wit.
Join me as I dive deep, selfishly soak up all the insights, and hopefully share a little inspiration with you along the way—one SaaS story at a time.
SaaS Stories
From Homelessness to Tech Innovator: Roann's Journey to Revolutionise Furniture Delivery with Cobber
What if personal adversity could lead to groundbreaking innovation? Meet Roann Junio-Hartman, the visionary CEO of Cobber, whose inspiring journey from homelessness ignited a transformative idea: an Uber-like platform for second-hand furniture delivery.
During the pandemic, Roann combined resilience with her computer engineering expertise to create Cobber, overcoming limited capital and leveraging a dedicated team in the Philippines. Hear how her background and tenacity paved the way for a partnership with the Salvation Army, making same-day furniture deliveries a reality and showcasing her knack for finding market gaps.
Roann's story doesn't stop there. Discover how she raised initial capital through personal connections, and how the sharing economy can empower micro-entrepreneurs to thrive.
Welcome everybody to another episode of SaaS Stories Today. I'm super excited to be joined by Rowan Hunio-Hartman, ceo of Cobber, and what an inspirational story she has for us today. Welcome.
Speaker 2:Rowan. Thanks Joanna. Thank you for having me. I'm glad to be able to share my story to your audience.
Speaker 1:Absolutely so. Cobber was born out of some personal challenges, which you have shared some openly. I'd love to learn about your story and how that experience has really shaped the vision and mission of the platform.
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. Eight years ago I became homeless, left the rental property that we were in. I was married at the time and you know, migrant Women's Services had helped me, put me on a temporary motel for a few weeks and then, you know, the help advocated for me, put me in temporary housing with my kids. My kids were little at the time. Both of them are now in. My son is graduating in primary school and my daughter is in second year high school.
Speaker 2:And yeah, so at the time, yeah, we were moved into temporary housing, then public housing. But then that's the sort of journey of having to restart and sourcing second-hand furniture which you know made sense, made a lot of sense for me at the time being in lower income household. So, yeah, so moved into this empty house and have to source. And I remember having a social worker at the time. The first dining table that we used was donated I can't remember where it was from.
Speaker 2:But that journey of someone restarting, sourcing secondhand, is something that is lived experience and the process and the friction around that task has been daunting for me.
Speaker 2:Without any transport, immediate family, sometimes I wish, like I wish I've got, like my brothers I can call, but you know I've got none of that and friends they've got their day jobs kind of thing, and sometimes it feels sort of I feel ashamed to have to ask for a favor and that and then it's constantly been my became like a problem for me.
Speaker 2:I'd even offer those who sell, for example, a cabinet, for example, if they can deliver, happy to pay. And I usually just target locally, within five kilometers, because I don't want to be like a pain too much and I get lucky sometimes if they've got the means to deliver it and if they don't, then got the means to deliver it and uh, if they don't, then I just have to miss out and and then yeah, so just uh, during covid, um, I sort of had a light bulb moment, um, wishing that there was some sort of kind of like an uber for this kind of problem. You know, I can just book it in. Uh, somebody nearby can come with a trailer or you can come and pick up my purchase from address A to my house. Ideation to market validation, to building products with zero capital, because I raised some, some funds to develop the the product with.
Speaker 2:Like friends, family fools round and yeah, and using that money as well to enter the market and and now have a b2b partner as well and like, uh, yeah, and entering the sort of journey with absolutely sort of I I did have a computer engineering background in the philippines but uh, that was in the dot-com era in my early 20s. Um, yeah, we had no full stack um tech uh concept at the time. Um, but I I do kind of have like a mindset, um, and you know, as you know, technology also evolve and that and changes and but.
Speaker 1:I do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do have the mindset and, uh, I just learned as I go, kind of thing and it's, it's been such a an incredible journey see, am I right in thinking you've?
Speaker 1:you've developed it yourself as well. You're kind of the decoder, the developer, the co-founder, the ceo.
Speaker 2:You're wearing lots of hats at the moment I'm wearing a lot of hat, but I did not, uh, code, I I'm not a coder, so but I I said to my team I've got got a team in the Philippines that's been helping me and I, you know, and then I've got a volunteer at the moment who's my CTO, who's volunteering helping me to sort of communicate in a technical sort of way that I couldn't, so it just fills in my gap that I couldn't, so it just fills in my gap. And um, yeah so, uh, yeah so. But but I said to to my uh, my, my team in the Philippines that, uh, you know, hopefully at the end of this project I can qualify as a project manager. And they all giggle, but, yeah, that's been my sort of, I suppose, because of my wanting to really solve the problem, I get involved and I just learn as I go from my team.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, so, my team in the Philippines, I pay them on like an ad hoc, project-based, very lean approach with no retainer. So, for example, because I've got a partnership with the Salvation Army that's starting next week, okay, yeah, so we've developed the web-based tool for them to be able to, and this web-based tool is the one that you know the staff can book in the same day delivery, and that web-based tool talks to our existing driver app, so it gets sent out to local independent contractors so that the items in the store can be, you know, can be moved same day rather than like waiting two weeks. Um, yeah, so have you? Have you walked into a salvo store before, or someone?
Speaker 1:you have, I have, yeah, yeah, and I love that. You kind of found a gap. It's. I always hear the story of some of the best products like this they found a gap in the market and they've just been, you know, just relentless and passionate about solving this problem that exists in the world. So I think you know it's an amazing story. I'm really fascinated by the story of you, know, trying to build it on like very little funding, you know, no capital raising, I suppose. Yeah, like the lean model in the Philippines. Maybe for any listeners out there that are kind of wanting to launch their own SaaS product and they're struggling to raise any capital, struggling with the whole VC process, what recommendations do you have for them?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So my recommendation is try and earn as much money, try and charge customer for that particular idea as early as you can with the least amount of tech work, whether that's just, for example, a landing page. So, going back, this is what I would have probably have done it, but I, you know, completely zero experience, experience, but I'm happy where I am, where I am now. But now that, like reflecting on it, um, the way I probably would have done it is I, because I'm, I don't like kind of identify as a transport and logistics person. I'm more of like a software kind of person. I identify, you know, as a platform owner, um, but in my niche you kind of have to. So if I were to go back, I would probably just created a landing page, just, you know, onboarded, independent contractor, without the app, you know, just the landing page and then get and then find my, create a Facebook group. So at the moment I've got a Facebook group that has 4000 members in it. So it's a free furniture Adelaide group, because our sort of main vision is around circular economy, so it's just helping people to sort of recirculate the furniture and then, if they can't pick it up, then we've got the service you know to to help them. So I've got a community of 4,000 people in there and I could have done that and then create like a group to get my first 10 customers and then grow from there. And then, yeah, and then just create, build a landing page and then ask them to book it in that landing page and then I'll just engage it manually with my independent contractor and act like a booking agent until, yeah, go from there until I'm able to build the app. But luckily I've got some group of small business individuals who have had helped me. Do you want to learn how to, or do you want to sort of hear about how I raised my initial funding? Absolutely Go for it. Yeah, so I'm actually a law student. So at the time during COVID, I'm studying law. I'm still studying law now, just part-time.
Speaker 2:So the lady, she's a classmate. We were in the same class but she's a lawyer now because I did a sort of pause in my law studies because I was building cover and then I just last semester went back and re-enrolled in one subject. So she's a lawyer now, but at the time she is a law student. So I pitched to her the problem that I'm trying to solve. I showed her the financial forecast and so she identifies with the problem. And she was telling me that one time she had to pick up one item, she had to hire a youth, and the process of having to hire a youth, with the deposit and all that stuff that comes with it, filling out the form, and all that stuff and she could definitely identify with the problem and she thought it's a great idea.
Speaker 2:And so, just believing in my idea, she went to her accountant to just to sort of get some sort of validation. You know financial forecast she also showed to him as well. And she then came back to me and said oh, by the way, I want to invest, and my accountant wanted to invest as well, and my ex-husband, so between the three of them, I raised my first 20K, so the accountant helped me form the company as well, to create 100,000 shares and sold at $2.50 per share, and then the accountant then brought in a few of his small business networks to put some more money in and that money that I had as well did some R&D as well to just, yeah, r&d, so that to put money back into the company and yeah, it basically stretched out to a point to. You know, it's like entering the market and and getting partnership. Where I'm now and, and, yeah, and then next year, you know the, the, the scale plan, um, yeah loves to do.
Speaker 1:Well, I think it's amazing not just that you managed to raise funds, but that you also uh, you know got to know like an accountant and a lawyer, because those two are absolutely necessary for a business. I think if you have good advisors in those departments, you can go a long way for sure. Coming back to the concept of Kaba, now you use the concept and I'm sorry if I pronounced this wrong Bayanihan Did.
Speaker 2:I say that correct, you pronounced it perfectly yes, so does this mean?
Speaker 2:mateship. Yes, so it's a parallel sort of culture. It's a collective effort of community to help one person. So in the Philippines we have this culture where you know someone may be freshly married and then they're sort of building like a new home and the home is like made of bamboo and like nipa leaves. If you Google those photos bahay kubo you can Google bahay kubo you'd be able to like sort of visualize what I mean. But, yeah, pretty much made of that and uh, so once these houses built, uh, people in the community would come and lift and move this to the person's land and yeah, so people literally come out and help this person and uh, and I thought you know, just been looking at words because I sort of wanted it to. I'm Australian citizen now, but I'm also kind of like, what's the word?
Speaker 2:intersectional sort of person, woman you know, yeah, I'm very proud of my you know Australian culture as well. And then I researched for like a great name, one word and sort of associate with the vision and the brand, and I, yeah, I learned about the word kaba and so one of my law professor had said that it's actually an older word. So kaba means mate, but it's a sort of an older word, and he said to me that he's really happy that the word is sort of starting to come back. Yeah, so, and you know, just wishing that you know you've got a Kaaba to come out and help and you know, on demand sort of thing.
Speaker 2:So, it's a great world if we've got that kind of you know, community sort of platform. So that's, yeah, that's the whole vision, and opposite of isolation is connection.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and there's a lot of people out there who has a trailer, you know larger vehicle, who's also happy to get paid on ad hoc basis on in their own time kind of thing, and I, I do feel as well that, uh, because of the ai, um emergence, and uh, there's going to be like 375 million of job displacement worldwide and by 2050, and uh, the uh, sharing economy platform, uh, micro entrepreneurs, um, you know, looking for ways to, you know, bring in income in their household, uh is where we come in and I, you know, just think that uh, yeah, it could be a great opportunity and our model yeah, our model as well is, uh like, we made it in such a way that it's so worth it for the driver and also, um, uh, affordable for the customer as well, and what we've validated so far is our customers are happy to pay, and I believe it's because of the, the pain point that I'm trying to solve as well.
Speaker 2:It's just that process of having to, you know, do it yourself and that, and, yeah, people are just happy to not have to deal with it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it's a brilliant idea. I mean, you're right coming back to connection, and of course this was exasperated by COVID and the lockdowns. I think, you know, there's kind of a loneliness epidemic at the moment where people find themselves lonely they maybe don't have, especially if they've moved to a different country as well, maybe the family's in a different country. They can't ask them for help. Friends are not as close as they kind of have gotten used to. It's very hard to go out and ask someone for help. So I think, having this platform at hand you know, especially if you're moving, you need secondhand furniture, you need some help, you need someone with a trailer. It's, yeah, it's brilliant that they can now find this help on a platform. So, yeah, well done.
Speaker 2:Thank you, and actually one of our customers made a comment about that, saying that her mum has English as her second language and she still finds it uh difficult to have to, you know, call someone and have to negotiate, have to talk to them, have to organize.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she said that being able to book not having to talk to anyone, uh, she thought it was brilliant and gives her mom a bit more confidence and a bit more independence. Yeah, oh, wow, like I just realized, like how you know the, the inclusivity that our platform, um, sort of the level of that, uh, help with people and inclusivity is like it's like the first time. When I heard about that, like the, the facets of like inclusivity is like I realized that you know, yeah, it just makes me happy being able to help in that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. I think I love the platform and I love the mission that you're on it, the way it was inspired and the you know the help that it's going to offer. It's actually Australia's first peer to peer delivery platform for bulky second-hand goods. What were some of your biggest hurdles in developing the technology behind Cover?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so in the beginning I was absolutely have no clue on how. To you know, I started with zero financial capital.
Speaker 2:I'm lucky that this lady, who's also a single mom, who's now a lawyer, believed in me or believe in what I'm trying to do and yeah, and it all started from there. But yeah, no, I would say that I've got no sort of knowledge in full stack. I don't know how to start. You know everything pretty much like I feel like I was blindfolded, dipping my toe and just go for it. Um, but what I found incredible is like I've learned as well as I go and, like I said earlier, I feel like I'm gonna be like I can have like a certification for uh, product ownership or project management in the sector, just like from learning in my journey. So that has been one of my biggest challenge and I had to source a CTO to do some advocacy for me to kind of like speak, step in my shoe or fill in my gaps, to be able to talk to engineers, because what the engineers do, they don't. They will not think outside the box, because sometimes thinking outside the box could become a problem. You know, if you're trying to just achieve a certain way, they will just kind of like will achieve that. They will not go over, because it can become a problem sometimes.
Speaker 2:Um and uh, yeah, so I've uh outsourced uh as a cto, um, so he's got a cto as a service. But he's also very lucky also to uh find someone who's also only like, very selective in the kind of job that they or project that they kind of want to take in. So he found Kaba to be really interesting and he's been there. So I initially actually was paying him, but now I'm not paying him anymore, it's just an equity-based arrangement. But, yeah, so my focus is to, you know, make this money and be able to pay people and um, yeah, um, uh, what else? Yeah, so no, completely no tech tech knowledge. I just learned as I go, um and um, yeah, yeah, I'm just thinking about it like my journey from the beginning to now, like I can't believe I pulled this off. I can't believe I published products in Play Store and App Store.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I'm actually first in my family as well that have done this publishing something in play store and app store, and I I thought, uh, in the beginning that was like out of reach, um yeah, just like kept going, went for it and um yeah, yeah, yeah, well, uh, I hope your story today, you know, to anyone listening that's kind of thinking.
Speaker 1:I have this idea. I found this gap in the market. I really want to do something about it, but I'm too scared it's not for me. You know, I don't know anything about coding, I don't really have any money to start. Well, hopefully they're inspired by your story and they just go for it because you know it can be done, absolutely, definitely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sorry, and there's a lot of I just wanted to add as well, because for female founders that may not know what to do, there's a lot of support in our ecosystem. For example, I joined in platforms like Tech Ready Women, for example, so you can get tips there from women who have done it before. So, and yeah, and get yourself a mentor as well.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Happy for them to contact me as well if they need some questions. I've become like I'm in a sort of level in such a way, that I've been so resourceful that I've got a lot of resources here and there and happy to help them and so that also at the same time they don't get ripped off.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's a tough one. Oh, that's very generous of you, um, very kind. Uh, absolutely, I think someone that's just starting out on this journey and doesn't have the resources, I absolutely would need a mentor. I think mentor any kind of forums, communities that they can access, I think are a must. So thank you for the offer. I think that's very kind. Coming back to scaling strategies, how did you manage to scale Cover? How did you manage to get, like the first lot of customers onto the platform?
Speaker 2:Yeah definitely, or cover. How did you manage to get like the first lot of customers onto the platform? Yeah, definitely so. Um, I I've just uh joined uh people like groups with sort of a lot of um segmented groups so, for example, um think her in adelaide uni.
Speaker 2:So so you know, one of my um customer target in the beginning are international students that don't have a car. They still need that desk, you know, they still need that wardrobe. Um, and yeah, it's the same problem. Pain point pretty much, and some of them are actually my repeat customers. Have been international students as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they pay between $60 to $150 to get something picked up. Sometimes they find them for free and things like that. So, yeah, so I hang out where a lot of international students are, or students in Adelaide Uni Think Lab. So there's this group called Think Her in Adelaide Uni Think Lab. So there's this group called Think Her in Adelaide Uni that facilitates for, you know, future entrepreneurs or student entrepreneurs. So I've met some of my customers there and then a women's group as well on Facebook, and then my local community and then my local community sort of notice board kind of thing. So one lady found me there and she became a repeat customer and she referred me to other, you know, some of her network as well.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, one of my customer target is women. So women in my situation or women in general, maybe women professional who's been working the whole week and can't be bothered and that, uh, to pick something up and um, yeah, and then um, yeah, most of them have been my repeat customer. I found my first 10 customers there and then also now with um, my Facebook group as well. So my download like sometimes I wake up and there's like 10 downloads that you know I wake up in the morning oh, there's 10 more downloads today. That's great, and yeah, I you know. Ring them and engage with them. Just say hi, offer them a 15% voucher if they need anything done, and then I ask them where they find me and that. So some of them are from the Facebook group that I've created, and yeah, so one of the things as well that I find like as a strategy is to make sure to like create a group that sort of adds value to your target niche so yeah, in my case it was the free furniture adelaide group.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so they get free furniture. They can get rid of furniture that they don't want anymore and yeah, we recirculate that.
Speaker 1:And if people can't pick up, then that's where we come in yeah, it actually sounds like you've ticked two boxes that are absolutely necessary in the world of sass. One is identifying your ideal client profile, and I think you nailed it with the university students, because in a lot of them, you know, it's not that they don't have money, they very much lack time, they lack resources, they're new to the country, country, they're just looking for some help. And I think you know women in your situation as well. That's absolutely necessary for them. And the second one I think you nailed is customer success, because it sounds like you know a lot of your customers are actually coming from your existing customers. You know they're kind of your biggest advocates and they're telling everyone about that platform. So I'm pretty sure it's only a matter of time that you're going to wake up and you'll probably have a hundred downloads instead of ten.
Speaker 1:What I love about Cobbadoe it contributes to the circular economy because essentially it reuses second-hand goods. And I think you know ESG is a topic that we talk lots about. I think it's becoming a priority. I think you know ESG is a topic that we talk lots about. I think it's becoming a priority here in Australia, you know, especially in the APAC region. So how do you see technology playing a role in supporting this cultural shift towards sustainable consumption?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I think we're in a perfect timing to, yeah, be in the space, and one of the things that I'm really proud of is that, like in my journeys, because it all started because I couldn't pick up furniture and then built the business model around it and then, oh wait, there's more. There's this another segment that we could solve while we're doing it. We could solve while we're doing it and you know, and also strategize in a way that if I sort of frame it around this strategy, it will save me a lot of user acquisition costs. So, for example, partnering with the local council. So it was actually the mayor who helped me point out our.
Speaker 2:The mayor in my local council shout out to mayor Chris Hanna.
Speaker 2:So I went to a networking at the time and and then, you know, during networking I don't play around, I go straight to the, my key person of interest and so I asked the mayor if there's some sort of you know, innovation or they're helping businesses in innovation, and and then I've told him what I'm doing about Kaba, and then he pointed out the.
Speaker 2:He helped me actually identify this problem segment within local councils and he said that when they have a curbside problem, so you know when people put things at the curbside and there's a lot of sort of situation that's happening there. It's either sometimes the people they have to leave the house tomorrow you know they're being kicked out and that that and they kind of don't have a choice or, yeah, don't have large transport so they'll just it's like easier for them to just put it at the curbside, yeah, with the hope that someone will come pick it up for free. And the problem with that is, you know, three weeks later it's still there and it gets framed on and it gets damaged and you know that's a community asset that's been wasted. And Gumtree Australia mentioned that there's 60 billion of those assets in communities, in households. So five thousand dollars per household in Australia that could, you know, be recirculated. And in Adelaide alone there's like 43,000 of household that we know of that we've, you know, research on that's participating in that kind of behavior.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I built a model around that. I built a model around that and we've got a product roadmap for pre-screening of secondhand furniture so that they get redistributed back to anyone who would accept them. And I've created this distribution network, distribution sort of system so that those furniture don't have to, you know, they no longer have to put it at the curbside, they can just the customer can just take a photo, upload it onto the app and then, once it's in the app, we see it in our admin panel and then we send it to, for example, salvation Army for donation and then they get to pre-approve it and if they click yes, then a job is created. Local independent contractor comes pick up and then they get to pre-approve it and if they click yes, then a job is created. Local independent contractor comes pick up and then send it to salvos.
Speaker 2:If not, uh, some of our um you know partners that we're looking to onboard, for example, uh, habitat for humanity also have a like, a great feedback, and I'm working on the um getting them on board as well.
Speaker 2:So, based on like people's, like these organizations standard, for example, maybe if it's a missing handle, then maybe salvos won't accept, but then habitat for humanity will accept it.
Speaker 2:Then it goes to them and if it's like worst case scenario where, for example, it smells like cat pee, for example, yeah, um, so it gets either sent to refurbishers who completely remove the material and uh, refurbish it and resell it and all they gotta do yeah, all they gotta do is to receive them for free. And the uh cost it's a cost to like a subsidized cost to a customer because, um, sometimes it's also um, would cost them money to have to book. Like a subsidized cost to a customer, because sometimes it also would cost them money to have to book a hard rubbish person to pay. So if it's a subsidized cost, we'll get our corporate partners in the space to sponsor us, to offset their carbon and it will go towards this cause. So, yeah, that's the model and I've patented this method as well on the pre-screening of second-hand furniture as well. So there's going to be machine learning AI upgrade into the app at some stage once I've made, hopefully, my you know, millions doing scaling with the Salvation Army partnership.
Speaker 1:Yeah, brilliant, brilliant. It sounds like lots of opportunities there, and I mean AI and machine learning there's. There's a lot of that to come. I'd love to. You're now a CEO of the company you're managing. You obviously the tech team in the Philippines, but then obviously you've got some support from other people as well. I'd love to know any lessons on leadership and really how to deal with people so that they're kind of happy and productive.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. One of the person that inspires me is my mentor. His name is Shane Radbone. I met him at Adelaide Uni and so he's actually the one who helped me with Salvation Army, putting me into the right people, and he managed a lot of people. He was previous CEO of Cheapest Chips and 7-Elevenven and all other companies.
Speaker 2:He used to be a footy player as well back in the days, because I googled him at one time because I absolutely had no idea who he was, and there's a lot of these um you know stuff comes up on um on YouTube and apparently he used to be an AFL player.
Speaker 2:But anyway, one of the things that he tells me about is, yeah, nurturing those relationship, partnership relationship, for example, with the Salvation Army, with the Salvation Army team, and also with like just talking to people as well, also with like just talking to people as well. And yeah, I'm sure there's more that I can learn from him as a you know CEO who has done it for years and managed thousands of people for years. But yeah, so that's one of the key thing partnership development and yeah, it does take a lot of skill, like even the right way to say so that you can, you know, don't come across as you know, whether it's pushy or you know, approach it in such a way that you know you're adding value and it's like a benefit to them to engage with you, kind of thing?
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely. I think partnerships are very important to scaling. They're one of the quickest ways to scale, I find. So I think if you can find some good partners, if you can find a win-win situation, it absolutely works brilliantly in the world of SaaS. And cheaper way as well with acquisition costs.
Speaker 2:One of the things that I've learned from mentorship was, yeah, user acquisition costs, because a lot of sort of my mentors at ThinkLab would throw hard questions at me along the lines of but it's, you know, if it will cost you $10 to acquire a customer, for example, that's not sustainable, you don't have a business along those lines. And I had to like really push for, yeah, b2b partners, and I did my. I sort of I asked my mentor this is what I want. And then my mentor, shane, had sort of, yeah, just put me in the right with the talk to the right people. And it's actually transformational for me because someone who is not known in the industry if I go and knock on Salvo's door, for example, oh they won't pay attention, but you've got to have the kind of Shane Redbone who can do for you. I call the king my king maker, if you've read the book the king maker by Martin Luther King.
Speaker 2:So they're like the advocate, either coach or mentor. Yeah, you gotta. You have to have those kinds of people in your corner and it's it's not difficult. You'll be ignored by other people sometimes, but the right people will. The universe, I believe, will put you with the right people the right people.
Speaker 1:I love that. I love that I've I've listened to a lot of advice from people where they say you know, there's no such thing as self-made. You're always even if it's like you're the founder and this is your product. You've relied so much on other people's help and I love that you call out a lot of those people and you recognize that you know you can't do things alone in this world. So I absolutely believe in that. Good partnerships, good mentors. Surround yourself with good people that believe in you and just want to make it a better product and a better business. Brian, my last question for you, a positive one what do you look forward to in the future?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So over the next two years I'm really excited about making money because, you know, once I make this money, it will give me license to create more impact. Create, you know, invite more partners, invite more, I don't know. Investors maybe, but I they will be investing because to scale and not because you know I need I need to kind of thing.
Speaker 2:I want to be able to like pull this off really well and um, and also to build that uh machine learning ai roadmap as well. Yeah, that's a big thing because once I've completed the model with my local area, then I can then take that to all the councils in Australia pretty much and include it in as their donation model to reduce the curbside dumping and yeah, that's really something that I really get excited about. Um, I think somebody has said to me uh, katie from best rated transport, one of my uh networking business, they um focus on like uh bigger transport interstate. So she said to me, because she remembers the, the way uh donations work. Um, you know they ring you and they come and sometimes, if it's not acceptable, then they just have to move on. She said to me uh, I'm pretty much and and sorry, I just wanted to add that there's like cost um inefficiency with that.
Speaker 2:So a they uh businesses pay um you know um workplace cover for their in-house driver and then, rather than like if they can leverage network of independent contractors, micro entrepreneurs, the risk can then be passed to those local professionals and then B a cost of fuel as well and to maintain those trucks in-house as well. And so she said to me Katie said to me that I'm basically changing the way furniture are donated, probably in the last hundred years, maybe like ever and that statement really truly inspired me and I was like, yes, I, I gotta really make this money to create more impact. Yeah, so that's the goal scale with the b2b partners and create more impact yeah for sure.
Speaker 1:I think you're definitely making an impact. I think you're helping a lot of groups in need. You're making a trailblazing product which doesn't actually exist at the moment. So I think it's amazing. I think, for anyone listening, I mean, there's a few key takeaways. So, if anyone wanting to invest maybe is listening to reach out to you and also, as you kindly offered, if anyone's on their journey towards building a product and they're a little bit nervous, maybe, reach out for some mentoring and some advice. So, rowan, thank you so much for being on the SaaS Stories podcast. I really appreciate you and I love your story, so thank you for sharing it with us today.
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me, Joanna.
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